IE8 again - this time a font problem

[ideasguy]

Ive resisted the temptation to upgrade from IE6 to IE8 until yesterday - it was either subversive or an an accident!

Anyway, I'm now on IE8. First thing to notice was the fonts appeared differently on the forum - blacker
I tried other websites, including my own and the effect was the same.

Ive wasted all this morning trying to research and tackle this latest time wasting problem, and tried every option and setting that I can find on the IE8 tools and Internet Options settings. No can fix!

Before going into all that detail, please do a test if you have more than one browser installed on your computer.
Compare the fonts when viewing:
a) this forum
b) my website http://www.ideasforgardens.com/
c)our WPG  website http://www.ideasforgardens.net/

My website b) is left adjusted in Mozilla Firefox and centralised in IE. That was the case with IE6 so no change there, so ignore that difference in this comparison exercise.

Its the font thats giving me big concern.

[roiphil]

have tried your 3 links in IE8 my normal browser, and mozilla firefox
text sizes on the pages are the same on all 3 links

same here on the other 2 sites the content is to the left of the screen whereas in IE8 it is central, this maybe my firefox settings, dont use firefox as i am happy with IE stick with what you know

edit
just looked in the setting for firefox and default text is times new roman size 16 yet text is same size in both browsers
IE8 text size set to medium

[NightHawk]

Checked using Mozilla Firefox 3.6.3 and IE 8 32-bit and IE8 64-bit versions and Windows 7.

No difference in any of those browsers George for all those web sites.  Fonts are exactly the same.

Laurie.

[ideasguy]

Should have said, I'm using Windows XP.

Anyone else using XP and doing this comparison test?
You need to have both browsers open and on the same page and be able to tab between them to make a good comparison.

[ideasguy]

Its been a bit of an eye opener for me in that if I'm having problems, so are others.
The problem is, Ive gone to a lot of trouble to have consistent fonts defined for my websites, and they are being totally ignored by IE8 (assuming that is indeed the cause).
Ive tried redesigning one small web site as a test.
It uses style sheets (as do my other sites)

In my research, I read that web developers should not use px or pt for display.
Ive updated most of my websites recently, and of course, sods law, I actually changed TO  using pt sizes.
It was easy peasy and looked real good (or so I thoght!)

The experts recommend using em or %
However, read up about that lot and your head will burst with the confusion that abounds.
Lets just say it looks a bit tricky to use em unless you know exactly what you are doing.

What do Malcolm and Laurie and any other members with websites use for font sizes in your websites?
Have you tried to see if the user can change the Text size?
To do that, click View, then click Text Size. Try the different settings (usually its set to normal)

[NightHawk]

.... What do Malcolm and Laurie and any other members with websites use for font sizes in your websites?

As you know George, Kathy and I used to design web sites as an online business so you had to get things correct from the start.  We used the HTML coding method and originally this was before Style Sheets existed.  Later on we used Style Sheets in our designs, which made it far easier to change certain parameters, such as font size or font colour, instead of having to make any changes to many web pages.

Generally, you could not code the web pages to look good in every browser that was available.  As a rule of thumb you designed the pages to look good in the most popular browsers.  When we were designing web sites, these were IE and Netscape Navigator/Communicator, then later on Mozilla Firefox.  There was always a slight trade-off where the layout was not perfect, especially in the older version browsers several years ago, until the browser developers made them more generally compatible.  But there are still some inconsistencies in web page layout even now.

Before Style Sheets were introduced, we used to set a 'Basefont' in the BODY section of our web pages.  For example, the default Font Size would be 10 pt (point), and if we wanted a smaller or larger font size in different parts of the web pages we would indicate that by using 'plus' or 'minus' symbols followed by a number.  +2 or -2 would mean a font size 2 pts bigger or smaller than the Basefont size we had set.

Now we use Style Sheets for our own web site designs (we don't design as a business any more).  We have both been through online classes specifically for using Cascading Style Sheets (CSS), and the system being taught for dealing with Font Sizes is by using the pt notation.

George mentioned certain web site developers now don't use pt, for whatever reasons they might be, but we have never had any problems using pt.

In a perfect computing world, whatever web page coding method that is used should be cross-browser compatible.  But, as you know, we don't live in a perfect world so we have to make do as best we can.

Laurie.

P.S.  I use IE set in Compatibility View.

[ideasguy]

Very good write-up Laurie, and as always its thorough and well explained.

One comment from me...
RE:

until the browser developers made them more generally compatible.  But there are still some inconsistencies in web page layout even now.

An understatement, to put it mildly.
Its obviously beyond mere mortals to understand why Browser developers have so much difficulty adhering to www standards, so that web pages render exactly what web developers have designed - and give us www consistency!

I think I will stick with the point method! Its very easy to work with and fairly reliable.

[newplantguy]

Yes very informative Laurie.
I see myself as a mere mortal and I do not think they will ever standerdies.
Why is it last week fonts were the same now I see it in a different font, it is not a huge issue but the font in google is not as easy on the eye.
Carry on as you are George.
Paul.

[ideasguy]

RE: (Paul)

Why is it last week fonts were the same now I see it in a different font,

Thats what is so frustrating.

On the IE8 menu, try clicking Tools, then click Compatibility mode when looking at a site which has changed.
That is supposed to make the website look the same as it did in IE7.
That being the case, when I do it in professional sites like Google mail, it make not one bit of difference to the font. Its still not what it was when I had IE6.
Compatibility mode does not make IE render my sites correctly, at least in my computer.

In this topic, others have reported no difference between Firefox and IE8, so perhaps there is another setting somewhere.
I have spent the best part of a day on this, and attempting to make my sites look as designed in IE8 

P.S. I'm getting used to Firefox. I think they are the winners in this shambolic situation.